tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post934433517980874967..comments2024-01-01T16:01:35.711+00:00Comments on Dick Puddlecote: Smoking Bans In Homes - A Clue To Their ImplementationDick Puddlecotehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-91193167817894028872011-01-04T18:38:28.769+00:002011-01-04T18:38:28.769+00:00Surely you mean 'when' - there's no &#...Surely you mean 'when' - there's no 'if' about it... despite the assurance given by ASH that they 'only wanted some places for non - smokers to go....' yeah - right....dunhillbabenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-81894337185108324882011-01-04T05:38:24.870+00:002011-01-04T05:38:24.870+00:00XX in which you are permitted to do what the law s...XX in which you are permitted to do what the law says you might. XX<br /><br />Bollox. That is an IMPOSSIBLE way to run a legal system. Otherwise I would be arresting people every day for starting off crossing the road right foot first instead of left, or booking people for drinking milk in paper cups...or.... because the law does not say they can do that.<br /><br />And just WHOES law do you THINK is running Britain today any way?Furor Teutonicushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13856575077967523322noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-44804183399896131732011-01-03T23:37:29.069+00:002011-01-03T23:37:29.069+00:00"common stairs and landings", not becaus...<i> "common stairs and landings"</i>, not because they are common but because they are workplaces, they have to be cleaned by cleansing workers.<br /><br />@<b> Furor Teutonicus </b> "<i> It is the very "government" that GIVES you that right.</i> Wrong, that is the European or Napoleonic tradition in which you are permitted to do what the law says you might.<br /><br /> Ours is that everything is permitted unless the law says otherwise.bannedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02406037760273820029noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-77474808137770254962011-01-03T14:30:48.863+00:002011-01-03T14:30:48.863+00:00Oh dear, oh dear.Oh dear, oh dear.Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-40235817036809891392011-01-02T14:00:04.950+00:002011-01-02T14:00:04.950+00:00XX Rate of Dissent said...
The government has...XX Rate of Dissent said...<br /><br /> The government has no right to ban smoking in private homes. XX<br /><br />You make one fundamental mistake; It is the very "government" that GIVES you that right.<br /><br />"He who gives may also take away."Furor Teutonicushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13856575077967523322noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-4894743761436766592011-01-02T13:25:40.825+00:002011-01-02T13:25:40.825+00:00I see Pravda is cock-a-hoop about the new Spanish ...I see Pravda is cock-a-hoop about the <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12104056" rel="nofollow">new Spanish smoking ban</a>.Gordon the Fence Post Tortoisehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04426735271858751220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-30027924394439083612011-01-02T08:38:12.996+00:002011-01-02T08:38:12.996+00:00"The government has no right to ban smoking i...<i>"The government has no right to ban smoking in private homes. Sure, smoking is bad for us, but so are a lot of things - too much sugar is bad for us. "</i><br /><br />Give 'em time, they'll get there!JuliaMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07844126589712842477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-51055977485464359802011-01-02T07:48:26.979+00:002011-01-02T07:48:26.979+00:00The government has no right to ban smoking in priv...The government has no right to ban smoking in private homes. Sure, smoking is bad for us, but so are a lot of things - too much sugar is bad for us. But the government doesn't care about what's bad and what's good (regardless of what they say) - they only care about control, control, control. And even if they did care about what's bad and what's good - it still isn't any of their business.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-10428363737878235592011-01-02T06:42:11.125+00:002011-01-02T06:42:11.125+00:00I did a survey on You Gov recently, in the middle ...I did a survey on You Gov recently, in the middle and totally unrelated to other questions was, 'Do you smoke?' followed by, 'Are there children in the house?'.<br />That's the direction they are heading.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-26852532211857100642011-01-02T03:25:14.835+00:002011-01-02T03:25:14.835+00:00DP: I think the clause which applies to common pa...DP: I think the clause which applies to common parts of multi-occupancy buildings is this one:<br /><br /><i>Section 2, subsection (7): Premises are “open to the public” if the public or a section of the public has access to them, whether by invitation or not, and whether on payment or not.</i><br /><br />But whether it applies if you can only gain entry to a communal entrance to a building using a key or a code or by being physically let in by a resident, I’m not sure.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-19279415697414277972011-01-02T00:38:18.290+00:002011-01-02T00:38:18.290+00:00OT, I suppose , but... I was talking to a pal who&...OT, I suppose , but... I was talking to a pal who's just come back from Las Vegas.<br /><br />Smoking in bars and clubs was apparently banned but not when gambling.<br /><br />Funny old world.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-9737269072523514802011-01-02T00:35:33.027+00:002011-01-02T00:35:33.027+00:00Really? I wasn't really thinking of getting on...Really? I wasn't really thinking of getting one. But if they want to ration people's supply won't they just find a way to do it to everybody?Belindahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16284836559314332001noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-19973229338372275562011-01-02T00:33:37.762+00:002011-01-02T00:33:37.762+00:00DP - you have forgotten something - insurance comp...DP - you have forgotten something - insurance companies. There to be got at with the greatest of ease.<br /><br />However, I don not think that such ideas are likely in the immediate future. If politicians have any brains whatsoever (which may be doubtful), they will realise that they are already getting plenty of flak from only those smokers who go to pubs. Ban smoking in cars or introduce no smoking clauses into insurance policies and you antagonise ALL smokers, which is a bit dangerous politically. <br /><br />But I am sure that the suggestions will appear in the fairly near future.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-12514427425195296962011-01-01T23:58:47.645+00:002011-01-01T23:58:47.645+00:00Belinda, I think you must be referring to 'sma...Belinda, I think you must be referring to 'smart meters' and the 'smart grid'. I wouldn't be in too much hurry to get one installed, since they can also be used to ration your supply (when the lights start going out !)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-61220303250759989492011-01-01T23:44:10.422+00:002011-01-01T23:44:10.422+00:00Belinda: I know of at least one person who was tol...Belinda: I know of at least one person who was told by a meter reader that he wouldn't enter the property (even for a few seconds) because he was smoking. He told him to fuck off till tomorrow then ... but he'd still be smoking. ;)Dick Puddlecotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-22906711584340228752011-01-01T23:32:26.862+00:002011-01-01T23:32:26.862+00:00I've heard that there are gas and electricity ...I've heard that there are gas and electricity meters being developed that will be read centrally and that won't require the use of meter readers. As it is they are only in the house for a split second anyway.Belindahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16284836559314332001noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-7137389521236236242011-01-01T23:26:38.899+00:002011-01-01T23:26:38.899+00:00Banned: "... spelling out that it only applie...Banned: <i>"... spelling out that it only applies to common stairs and landings"</i><br /><br />Not sure the Health Act says that, actually. It specified 'workplaces', not common areas in flats.Dick Puddlecotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-64245838186802646262011-01-01T23:23:19.045+00:002011-01-01T23:23:19.045+00:00Jay: On private landlords, yes, they can stipulate...Jay: On private landlords, yes, they can stipulate whatever conditions they wish so it's entirely different from legislation <i>demanding</i> they do so. Again, it's the state interfering in a two party voluntary agreement. Government increasingly likes to do that. <br /><br />And they will. You mention that mortgage-free owners of detached mortgages will be fine, but they won't either. There was a classic quote from Maureen Moore (ex-ASH Scotland supremo) stating that "even smokers need protecting from secondhand smoke". She was answering a caller who talked of a karaoke business run by two brothers in their own vehicle who were banned by law from smoking in it.<br /><br />Unless your detached, mortgage-free owner lives on his/her own, the law will eventually apply. But even if they fulfill all those criteria, they'll find other ways, such as denying police/fire/health services, or making it an offence to allow utilities meter readers into a smoker's home. <br /><br />Once the myth is ensconced, the world is their oyster. <br /><br />All those 'libertarians' who liked the smoking ban, eh? They don't realise how many doors to private property they actually opened to the state.Dick Puddlecotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-37669751017492449652011-01-01T22:59:06.353+00:002011-01-01T22:59:06.353+00:00Hi DP,
All four of the properties I've rented...Hi DP,<br /><br />All four of the properties I've rented since 1996 have had no-smoking clauses in the rental agreements, and I can only recall one property I considered renting that did not. So on my experience I'd be tempted to back Jay's statement.nbcnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-75923986510864816222011-01-01T22:56:02.991+00:002011-01-01T22:56:02.991+00:00@banned - Hi, looking in estate agents' window...@banned - Hi, looking in estate agents' windows.<br /><br />JayAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-36385329434129303552011-01-01T22:37:10.294+00:002011-01-01T22:37:10.294+00:00"Shug: Yes, that will happen too. In fact, I&..."Shug: Yes, that will happen too. In fact, I'd be surprised if some authorities aren't already doing so or already writing it into their tenancy agreements."<br /><br /> It is fairly well entrenched that local councils cannot enforce rules against something which is not ilegal, smoking/drinking/fireworks/pets, in their tenancy agreements though they do try by putting up "it is illegal to smoke in (sic) these premises" signs outside blocks of flats without spelling out that it only applies to common stairs and landings. <br /><br />As for the private sector they can ban anything they like because they are private property but do so at the peril of the free market.<br /><br />@anon 22:13 "I reckon that 75% of private rental properties are 'smokefree'".<br />I'd like to know where you got that from.bannedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02406037760273820029noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-32384716142880055702011-01-01T22:13:32.761+00:002011-01-01T22:13:32.761+00:00Private property landlords are quids in, already. ...Private property landlords are quids in, already. I reckon that 75% of private rental properties are 'smokefree'.<br /><br />Why couldn't 'social' landlords use the same grounds for justification?<br /><br />Private ownership? Take your pick: where there are children, child abuse (scandolous); where there are no children but you're semi-detached, third-hand smoke; where you're detached, risk of fire.<br /><br />The only people (if detached) are those who've paid off their mortgages.<br /><br />Jay <br /><br />As an aside, I've spent the day with friends. Despite there being six adults (four of whom smoked) and four children, we smokers 'voluntarily' decamped to the back door 'because the children don't like smoking'!!!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-83089552412354335892011-01-01T21:47:54.882+00:002011-01-01T21:47:54.882+00:00Oh well, given my only experience with MP's wa...Oh well, given my only experience with MP's was meeting Edwina Curry what can you expect? Sadly my other solutions are all illegal, very gratifying but still illegal!<br /><br />Thanks for reading my little rant, at least someone listens. <br /><br />JohnAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-34599559933514831722011-01-01T21:25:01.106+00:002011-01-01T21:25:01.106+00:00Excellent rant, John, but MPs don't 'do...Excellent rant, John, but MPs don't 'do' respect for the public or their property. The sooner people realise this, the better.Dick Puddlecotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-71093239411750375582011-01-01T21:21:07.304+00:002011-01-01T21:21:07.304+00:00These anti smokers are sick, they should all, from...These anti smokers are sick, they should all, from the lowly secratary at ASH through to the politicians who will no doubt support these ideas be commited to insane assylums!<br /><br />Any one who in good conscience is willing to brand parents who smoke as child abusers requires certifying, any MP who condones this needs to be fired from his or her position as a member of parliament as being unfit to hold that post due to insanity.<br /><br />Anyone who believes they can violate the privacy of this, or any other country's citizens without a clear and present danger in place, without a warrant or information that a criminal offence is taking place deserves commital to an institution for they are unfit to live among civilised human beings.<br /><br />It is a gross violation of every mans, every womans and every childs right to privacy in their own home, it is the ultimate violation of civil liberties, a violation of the last bastion of a free society. <br /><br />It cannot be allowed to become law, it must be stopped using every legal option up to and including the ECHR, if that fails then may whichever God you believe in help us all as we will have returned to the serfdom from which we came. <br /><br />I like the maxim 'Intolerance is the most preventable cause of inequalities' it is a good honest statement of fact but what happens when mankind becomes intolerant of inequality?<br /><br />John WatsonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com