tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post4757217255351961658..comments2024-01-01T16:01:35.711+00:00Comments on Dick Puddlecote: Do You Feel Protected By This?Dick Puddlecotehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-57665820031173301482010-06-21T07:15:14.476+01:002010-06-21T07:15:14.476+01:00Why ere the Police looking for the son under the m...Why ere the Police looking for the son under the mattress?rmghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06061984400554016112noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-55823913655588145212010-06-18T01:00:17.967+01:002010-06-18T01:00:17.967+01:00To answer the question:
Nope, not at all.
No mor...To answer the question:<br /><br />Nope, not at all.<br /><br />No more than I feel protected by the failure of the legal system to convict a single British policeman for deliberately shooting dead or seriously wounding an innocent member of the public.<br /><br />I guess, if we live long enough, we might see Saville II - "Stockwell" - I bet the legal eagles (vultures?) are wondering how they can swing it..<br /><br /><a href="http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/comment/blogs/s/1243046_opinion_paul_taylor" rel="nofollow"> Newspaper Blogger Paul Taylor</a><br /> <br />Of the £195m cost of the Saville Report, £100m went in legal fees. In the 12-year course of the inquiry, no less than 14 lawyers have raked in fees of more than £1m, with two legal eagles trousering more than £4m each<br /><br />As is often said - it's not justice it's "The Legal System" and plainly something is broken big style. TB and NL caved in to their demands at every turn... and one needs to look no further than Mrs B to see that they have more than their share of venal bullies in their ranks who will do almost anything for money. <br /><br />Muzzling public discussion of their carry ons is right up there - superinjunctions and all - I mean... how many "superinjunctions" don't we know about?Gordon the Fence Post Tortoisehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04426735271858751220noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-10205103922897462010-06-18T00:40:35.553+01:002010-06-18T00:40:35.553+01:00Does anyone here think like me that, in the circum...Does anyone here think like me that, in the circumstances of statute law, strict liability and minimum sentences, the word 'possession' needs to be clearly defined? As someone said elsewhere, if the court clerk held the gun, was he guilty of 'possession'? Was the policeman who took 'possession' of the gun when it was found, guilty of an offence? If an object such as this old gun were found in my garage, would I be guilty of 'possession' even if I knew nothing about it? If this person had simply thrown the thing over someone else's garden wall, would the owner of the property be 'in possession'?<br /><br />For years and years I had a dagger in my house which I bought when I was about 17 years old. I used to wear it on my belt when I was youth hosteling in the 1950s. I was very loath to get rid of it because it evoked lots of happy memories. In the end, I took it to a police station and handed it in. I didn't want to just chuck it in the bin because who knows where it may have ended up?). The reason for getting rid of it was that I had by them acquired grandchildren, and I thought that it would be better if it ceased to be in my house. <br /><br />Supposing that the same 'strict liability' law had applied to daggers? It was definitely in my possession and it was also hidden, but only in the top box of my wardrobe under some clothes (to keep it away from children). Which brings me to my next point - if a person really wanted to hid A GUN, would that person just slip it under a mattress? <br /><br />It seems to me to be the case that this lady kept the gun merely because it was there - just like my dagger. Since it was so old and there was no ammunition, it was, for all intents and purposes, just a piece of metal. <br /><br />However, there are always circumstances that we are not aware of. Who know what the police were aware of about this family? It might well be the case that this gun has been used (without any certain evidence) to frighten shopkeepers, for example, into handing over their takings. These are the things that we know nothing about, and that the police cannot tell us. <br /><br />However, these possibilities do not detract from the argument that 'possession' needs to be properly defined.Junicannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-47843354770219135722010-06-17T21:52:34.326+01:002010-06-17T21:52:34.326+01:00The problem here is minimum sentencing. This ties ...The problem here is minimum sentencing. This ties the hands of the judiciary who cannot apply "common sense". <br /><br />Minimum sentencing is one of Labour's most pernicious legacies.The Great Simpletonhttp://www.thegreatsimpleton.me.uk/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-28928547822980397672010-06-17T20:11:24.636+01:002010-06-17T20:11:24.636+01:00A sad contrast with the USA where the state of Mon...A sad contrast with the USA where the state of Montana has considered secedeing from the union if Obama tries to carry out his threat and make them give up their assault rifles, heavy calibre machines guns and anti tank weapons.<br /><br />Well there are a lot of wolves and bears in the mountains.Ian R Thorpehttp://www/greenteethmm.com/obama-deepwater-horizon.shtmlnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-10399093048851456962010-06-17T13:38:33.746+01:002010-06-17T13:38:33.746+01:00"They were searching for her son and obviousl...<i>"They were searching for her son and obviously thought he was hiding under his mum's mattress."</i><br /><br />That's criminals for you - they do <a href="http://bobfordscallthecops.blogspot.com/2010/05/not-best-hiding-place.html" rel="nofollow">strange things</a> when pursued... :0JuliaMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07844126589712842477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-33509498277543950002010-06-17T13:27:27.984+01:002010-06-17T13:27:27.984+01:00Chuckles,
I hear you.
I should have stipulated t...Chuckles,<br /><br />I hear you.<br /><br />I should have stipulated that I was using common law to define a) a crime and b) a victim.<br /><br />The "law" used to put granny away was a statute.<br /><br />There is a world of difference and I should have explained myself better.<br /><br />But yes, mens rea will suffice.<br /><br />CR.Captain Rantyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07839241144954596066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-30263553566900315062010-06-17T13:24:14.519+01:002010-06-17T13:24:14.519+01:00""A firearms expert described it as &quo...""A firearms expert described it as "a trophy of war". It was found to be in poor external condition and had a faulty safety catch and trigger mechanism, but was in working order and could fire bullets.""<br /><br />Is the real question about weather the gun was under the matress or in a bag in the attic, or do we question the wisdom of jailing someone for 5 years because they own a 1922 antique pistol with no ammunition?<br /><br />The only justification for taking away a persons freedom is that they are a danger to others.<br /><br />I see no danger here and no justificationBuckohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03169970711606515445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-83359450159241001062010-06-17T13:02:11.027+01:002010-06-17T13:02:11.027+01:00Dick, I read somewhere (don't ask me the URL) ...Dick, I read somewhere (don't ask me the URL) that the gun was found under the woman's mattress when the police were searching the house looking for something which would help them find her son. He hadn't turned up for a court appearance.<br /><br />Why would anyone have a gun under a mattress? Surely if it was so old it'd be in a dirty old carrier bag in the loft.<br /><br />Oops I've just noticed Julia says the same. :)subrosahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00151702590329788260noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-69417792811064681872010-06-17T12:12:35.687+01:002010-06-17T12:12:35.687+01:00JuliaM ... maybe you could ask the police? They we...JuliaM ... maybe you could ask the police? They were searching for her son and obviously thought he was hiding under his mum's mattress. :)Smoking Hothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04534745989363293923noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-4297155419565340552010-06-17T11:38:18.115+01:002010-06-17T11:38:18.115+01:00Captain R,
I agree with the spirit of your argume...Captain R,<br /><br />I agree with the spirit of your argument, but I think that to play the 'victim' card is incorrect. Reference to, or the presence of a 'victim' is irrelevant. The knuckle-draggers in NL created so many classes and categories of spurious victim that she would definitely be guilty of something. e.g. If her neighbours had known she possessed the souvenir, they would have been outraged. Bang to rights immediately.<br />I think 'mens rea' is what you intend?<br />That, and of course the poisonous filth that is a 'strict liability' offence.Chucklesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-36940018751091284562010-06-17T11:33:50.799+01:002010-06-17T11:33:50.799+01:00"...does it really matter where she keeps it?...<i>"...does it really matter where she keeps it?"</i> <br /><br />If her argument was 'I didn't think it was against the law and I didn't want to use it, honest', then why keep it hidden?<br /><br />OK, we all know why. She (I suspect) kept it there to frighten off any burglar should she ever encounter one.<br /><br />But then, if we relaxed the gun laws, she wouldn't NEED a 83 year old anytique for that, would she?JuliaMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07844126589712842477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-80850496334480489822010-06-17T10:57:41.482+01:002010-06-17T10:57:41.482+01:00Julia: I can see where you are coming from, but se...Julia: I can see where you are coming from, but seeing as it wasn't loaded, she didn't have any ammunition, and one presumes that finding some which fits an 83 year old Czech weapon would be tricky, does it really matter <em>where</em> she keeps it?<br /><br />CR: <em>"No victim here."</em><br /><br />Yup. And arguably not even the potential for one.Dick Puddlecotehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01481866882188932892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-53138843694978873852010-06-17T10:54:14.165+01:002010-06-17T10:54:14.165+01:00Disgraceful that this woman should even have come ...Disgraceful that this woman should even have come to the attention of the courts. The handgun ban was bad enough, even just for its original intentions, but to jail someone for owning an ex WWII heirloom is unforgiveable. How many weapons made it back to the USA in the hands of the servicemen who had collected them?<br /><br />We have only recently had the <a href="http://fuelinjectedmoose.blogspot.com/2010/06/lock-up-fewer-criminals.html" rel="nofollow">discussion </a> about Ken Clarke wanting to cut sentances and reduce the prison population. Well here is the first candidate for release.<br /><br />As the Captain says, no victim, no crime.Buckohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03169970711606515445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-65797047958761507082010-06-17T10:33:56.782+01:002010-06-17T10:33:56.782+01:00This doesn't even come close to a crime.
For ...This doesn't even come close to a crime.<br /><br />For a crime to have been committed there needs to have been a victim: someone who has suffered loss, been harmed or injured, or someone who has been defrauded.<br /><br />No victim here. No-one harmed or killed.<br /><br />Who cares if she had an 83 year old weapon? <br /><br />Only nanny.<br /><br />This "crime" didn't even warrant an hour on the naughty step.<br /><br />All it does is prove that our judiciary are all fuckwits that shouldn't be allowed within a mile of a courtroom.<br /><br />Twats.<br /><br />CR.Captain Rantyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07839241144954596066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-59835619286350920972010-06-17T09:06:10.754+01:002010-06-17T09:06:10.754+01:00Oh, fumblefingers! Apologies for the erratic spell...Oh, fumblefingers! Apologies for the erratic spelling...JuliaMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07844126589712842477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3141759542968821728.post-43240023133831356542010-06-17T09:05:23.599+01:002010-06-17T09:05:23.599+01:00I dumnno. I've gor problems with this one (tho...I dumnno. I've gor problems with this one (though 5 years? That's a bit off).<br /><br />It's the 'keeping it under the mattress' bit that doesn't gel with her 'Och, it was just a wee souvenir' excuse.<br /><br />I have lots of souvenirs. Some are on display, some are tucked away in boxes in the loft or the garage. <br /><br />None, I repreat, <i>none</i> are concealed under my mattress!JuliaMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07844126589712842477noreply@blogger.com