Tuesday, 31 March 2015

More Truth-Free Junk From The BMA

There must be an organisational problem at the British Medical Association because they seem to have trouble finding spokespersons who can tell the truth on the radio.

We've seen the embarrassment that is Vivienne Nathanson before, a BMA mouthpiece who insisted that one cigarette smoked in a car emitted 23 times more toxins than in a pub prior to the smoking ban - despite it being complete and utter nonsense - and now we have Dr George Rae.

Speaking on BBC Radio Newcastle this morning on behalf of the BMA, he had this to say about e-cigs.


Yes. He is actually claiming that e-cigs are more capable of causing cancer than cigarettes themselves. A statement that is so comprehensively stupid that it consequently calls into question the veracity of the original 1950s research linking smoking to lung cancer, surely.

I mean, e-cigs have been around now for about a decade yet there has not been a single case of cancer attributable to them worldwide. So if they are more dangerous than cigarettes but there have been nil cancer diagnoses in that time, something else apart from smoking is causing lung cancer, isn't it?

Well, that's the only logical conclusion we can come to from his daft argument.

He is a doctor. A spokesman for the BMA, the doctors' union. He is a representative for other doctors and, presumably, an adviser to them. Doctors that you may know and who may treat you someday. Just think on that for a moment or two.

Scary, huh?

H/T SJ


21 comments:

Chris Price said...

Apart from plank-thick dumbness, his statement includes at least one blatant lie about cigarettes and medical benefits. Or perhaps they just found the most ignorant quack on pharma's pay list.

Dick_Puddlecote said...

Do listen to the rest of it here as that wasn't the only, err, inaccuracy he came out with. All rounded off with a plea for smokers to use the brilliantly successful products supplied by pharmaceutical companies, of course.

Jack Listerio said...

Here in the states the Nazis are screaming kids start smoking real cigs after using ecigs...........

Lisabelle said...

When controlling smokers, with propaganda and fearful lies, is more important than honestly suggesting tobacco harm reduction alternatives such as Electronic Cigarettes which can and do improve health. Shameful these people are in positions of power and influence!

Chris Oakley said...

As with all walks of life, there are good and bad within the ranks of the medical profession. Some are life saving geniuses, others are evil killers. Some are bright and open minded, others practice public health.

The problem is that the rest of the elite refuses to recognise this so gives air time and consideration to people such as Rae. Medical organisations such as the BMA, Royal College of Physicians (RCP) etc.. are fêted by media and political types despite the fact that they have no serious academic credibility at all. In intellectual terms, they are third rate but this is not apparent to the media because they are woefully ignorant and too lazy to research their topics. Many politicians are wilfully ignorant and intellectually incapable of researching their topics. So being right is now less important in medicine than gaining publicity by whatever means. The RCP now references the number of times it has appeared in the media as a success criterion in its annual report.



As a general guide, medics who are any good at what they do, tend to get on with it. Those who are less gifted become mouth pieces for trade unions or like Anna Gilmore, Martin McKee and others join the ranks of the public health parasites.

Dragonmum said...

All I could do when listening to this mindless moron was chew the carpet, then thank God for Dave Dorn who demolished him and pointed out that he was talking out of his rear end.

cfrankdavis said...

A statement that is so comprehensively stupid that it consequently calls into question the veracity of the original 1950s research linking smoking to lung cancer, surely.

Exactly. But what started me questioning the 1950s research was the comprehensively stupid claim that secondhand smoke was as lethal as firsthand smoke.

Chris Oakley said...

Update: Weapons grade idiot George Rae was a "star" in the BBC reality TV series 'Street Doctor'. I rest my case.

truckerlyn said...

So is it any wonder that many of have very little faith in the medical profession?

truckerlyn said...

Or worse, according to ASH in the past! Part of the paranoia they peddled was how one whiff of someones smoke could cause you to drop dead from a heart attack!


Obviously, logic dictates that if the person actually smoking is not dropping dead from a heart attack then it isn't going to happen to anyone in their vicinity, at least, not due to their smoke or smoking!

Jack Dawson said...

A good example of groupthink. Evidence is not going to alter this man's views and the General Medical Council, which should be examining his fitness to practice, is staffed by members of the same faith.

Dick_Puddlecote said...

Yes, I'm glad you pointed that out or I'd have missed it, I listened to his segment last night. https://twitter.com/Dick_Puddlecote/status/583028850537426945

Dick_Puddlecote said...

Good grief, you're right. http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006rg6w

Dragonmum said...

Those who can do - those who can't preach! Sorry.

PatNurse said...

perhaps if all vapers fought against controlling smokers and backing junk science on smoking in favour of conveniently pushing the same propaganda harm on smoking and ecigs as "a healthier alternative" then truth would out for both groups. Fight for the right to smoke and the right to vape naturally follows. Fight for the right to vape on the grounds that it is "healthier" than smoking and it will one day replace it, and save poor pathetic smoker's souls, and you'll find the health fascists will just use the same lies about smoking on vaping as is being shown here and elsewhere. United we will stand. Divided, we will fall. First us , then vapers, but there will be no one left to fight their corner when they're out on their own expecting privileges from tobacco control which will not come however much some of them lie to vapers and make them believe that they're not so bad.

Dick_Puddlecote said...

And another one.

"It is now widely accepted that about 10% of all patients admitted to hospital will be unintentionally harmed in some way. To put that into context: there are more deaths annually as a result of health care than from road accidents, breast cancer and AIDS combined."

http://www.evidenceintopractice.scot.nhs.uk/patient-safety/what-is-patient-safety.aspx

Dick_Puddlecote said...

Or there is a transcript at this link.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1GAojvSfxQu9YA8uphGKLv5PfjROQw7TwaB3TuJ1aKW0/mobilebasic?pli=1

nisakiman said...

Looks like the medical profession are on a roll!

Or perhaps it's just an alternative approach to eugenics. They can be quite selective in their position, after all.

"What, smoker, you say? Right, pull the tubes, nurse, we can't afford to waste resources on this one..."

jude said...

Perhaps if smokers had started standing up for their own rights, and fought back against the junk science coming from tobacco control for the last 5-6 decades, we wouldn't be in the position we are today.


Smokers were complacent, and still are, because they know that tobacco will never be outright banned, and many, (if not most), have been compliant with the restrictions on smoking, even agreeing with those same purveyors of junk science, to the point of believing that they were the victims of the "evil tobacco companies" , and addicts that could not help themselves, the "poor pathetic smokers". Perhaps thinking that this would protect them from having tobacco sales banned altogether, and to a certain extent it has.


Vapers face a different fight, we face the outright banning of an orders of magnitude safer product. A product that is not harming anyone, including the user.


I've never bought into the whole SHS or the ridiculous THS, and have never believed that smoking was as harmful as the ANTZ have portrayed it, and as a smoker, I did not suffer any health issues. That being said, I do know many former smokers, whose personal health has improved greatly when they have made the switch to vaping, and I have seen this with my own eyes, from people who don't have any links to ANTZ orgs.


Personally I'm happy to speak up for the rights of smokers, those that want to fight the restrictions on smoking and the extortionist "sin" taxes, but can fully understand why many think it is a battle already lost, and one lost by the surrender of smokers who refused to fight in their own corner, but took the road of appeasement instead.

PatNurse said...

Not this smoker dear. I've been fighting for about 20 years and often alone but without funding, as have many others who fought without the organisation, and the sort of money tobacco control has, all the while under threat of criminalisation, having your kids taken for being a child abuser, and your job under threat for fighting something most people have been groomed to hate and for doing something that your boss has been forced to believe means you are less of a worker than those who don't smoke. It's the smokers who quit on demand rather than fight - or who turned to vaping and became all righteous in a bid to become socially acceptable by shitting on smokers from a very great height that eventually did it for us. And no, I've smoked all my life, I've been around smokers all my life and I cannot honestly say that those who quit got "healthier". Many of them got horribly fat and are now targets of Nanny's war on obesity. Your lot won't fight for smoking because you need to bash tobacco and smokers to win favour with tobacco control. Vapers are not smokers and vice versa. In fact, and *Gulp* this hurts to admit - your movement is worse than tobacco control because you are a bigger bunch of hypocrites. Fight your battle by all means but as a lifelong smoker in excellent health, I am sick of your movement trying to gain ground on the back of promoting junk science about smoking and smokers - the same junk you refute when it's used against vaping. And be careful, dear, on how you use your language. "User" suggests drug addict so you're giving ammo to tobacco control to claim you're more of a pathetic nicotine addict in need of a chemical fix more than organic tobacco consumers who can clearly wait until they get the break that is continually denied to them. They do not have to keep sucking on a plastic stick. It is the same fight. That vapers don't recognise it means you're fighting to lose. Have you not seen all the signs going up NO VAPING/NO SMOKING - bigots see no difference and you won't persuade them otherwise. They'll just use you and then turn on and it will serve you damn well right. And, for your information. Tobacco does no harm to anyone other than the consumer and how much harm that does depends on what junk science you believe. The same junk science being stored up against vapers now. I go by experience and I simply have not seen people drop dead or get more ill then those who don't smoke in 48 years of smoking. I have seen both smokers and non smokers die of lung disease, car accidents, bike accidents, cancer, and anything else. No human disease is exclusive to smoking and smokers.

jude said...

Wow, what a bitter tirade, but you're aiming your attacks at the wrong person dear. I also fought as a smoker, and often alone, and with no support. I got sick of the apathy and self hatred displayed by so many smokers that bought into the anti-smoker crap, and were brainwashed along with all the non-smokers.


As I said I don't believe the nonsense about SHS or THS or whatever other nonsense they come up with, but smoking is not harmless to the smoker, although the claims have been and are greatly exaggerated, whether you choose to not see it is immaterial.


I'm well aware of how anti-smokers see vapers, and couldn't care less on a personal level, but I will fight the garbage coming from those ANTZ, and as a vaper, I know I'm not alone, I'm joined by former smokers, and some current smokers, those that aren't self hating, apathetic, or trying to portray themselves as victims.


I'll also support those that want to keep smoking, its their choice, just as vaping is mine.


I disagree that its the same fight, its not, but it is the same enemy.